The Revivalist Chicago Hotel Brand | The Neighborhood Hotel Founder Jonathan Gordon

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign. [00:00:08] Speaker B: Welcome to the Real Estate Chicago style podcast. I am your host, Joe Smazel. I'm a broker who sells apartment buildings in Chicago with a firm called Entero Realty. And then I own and operate some small apartment buildings on the north side of the city with my wife and that business is called SMAS Apartments. As always, thanks to my partner in producing the podcast, Stephen Caban from fullbars Media. Reach out to Stephen for any real estate marketing needs. He's awesome to work with. I've really appreciated the way that he's approached producing this with me. Today on the show, I'm joined by Jonathan Gordon, the CEO and founder of Experiential Capital Group, the owner, operator of the Neighborhood Hotel brand. The Neighborhood Hotel currently has four boutique hotels in operation in Chicago and southwest Michigan. Lincoln park in Little Italy in Chicago, and then New Buffalo and Grand beach in southwest Michigan. Potential fifth in the hopper and a lot of growth plans throughout Chicagoland and beyond. Jonathan, welcome to the show. [00:01:10] Speaker A: Thanks for having me. [00:01:11] Speaker B: Yeah, man, fun to do it. I've admired, we're talking a little bit about branding and I've admired your brand in the marketplace for, since you started it. It's just cool, cool concept, cool execution. And, you know, I like to see thoughtful marketing. I like to see businesses that have, there's, you know, there's a little bit of an invention within your, you know, kind of real estate platform that you've created. You filled a niche in the market and it's been cool to see it grow. [00:01:44] Speaker A: Appreciate that. [00:01:48] Speaker B: You know, before we kick off, I was, we were talking a little bit yesterday to catch up before this, and it came up kind of like why I'm doing a podcast. And it, I just figured I'd say for, you know, 30 seconds, it was, it was a whim. You know, I have had a fun time being on a couple podcasts and I've met and gotten to know, to different degrees, a lot of people that I really like in Chicago. And, you know, you get to be friendly with them, but sometimes you don't get beyond kind of a surface level conversation. So I thought it'd be a fun platform for kind of having the people on that I want to have on that I want more people to get to know. And then a side benefit is I am a big proponent of Chicago. I love the city of Chicago for, you know, the opportunity it's given me business wise, the experience it gives my family, raising our kids here and just like all the people you meet along the way. So it is Very much a pro Chicago effort, too. I know you're an advocate of the city, which I appreciate as well. [00:02:59] Speaker A: And I mean, you do a great job with the podcast. It keeps getting better and I've learned so much from all the past guests. [00:03:06] Speaker B: I appreciate that. [00:03:07] Speaker A: So, you know, keep, keep going with it and yeah, it's exciting to be here. [00:03:10] Speaker B: No, that's great, man. And Steven's been a big part of that. You know, I. For me, it's a pretty low bandwidth effort. We film two in a day once a month and, you know, it's always fun to do. It's a fun day to have. So I'm going to keep it going. We'll keep putting it out to a high standard. I am. Anybody that's reached out about it, I'm appreciative about because it gives you a little bit of like, I don't know, encouragement to keep it going. But more than that, like, I am all for people reaching out with guest recommendations or like ideas on topics or whatever. Because if I have that, it takes some of the thought process and the work out of it for me. I'm happy to talk about whatever people are actually interested in hearing about and who they're interested in hearing from. So anyway, I never talked about it, why I did it on the podcast and figured I'd address it. So anyway, we're starting with some rapid fire questions. Be as rapid as you like. What's your favorite intersection or corridor in the city? [00:04:11] Speaker A: I mean, I've lived in handful of neighborhoods. Wicker Park, river, north, ended at Rush and Bellevue, which just feels like main and main for, you know, my family and just different points of my life. Yeah, so I can go Bellevue, I can go head over the lake and be on the beach at Oak street and you know, five minutes, go for a run or hang out and you got skyscrapers behind you. Or I can, you know, be where all the action is. [00:04:39] Speaker B: Dude, it's wild. Like great corner, outrageous energy at that corner. But it is funny the way that you describe it, where you can take this really quiet neighborhood street straight to the lake and be active or like hang out. Or you can go on the north south street and be like right in the middle of the buzz, like the shopping, the dining, restaurant. Like it's a cool kind of like dichotomy is the word. But it's cool to have that like optionality right there, depending on which direction you turned. And maybe this question's related. What's your favorite Chicago restaurant? [00:05:19] Speaker A: I'm at Gibson's the most. You know, I can go, like, early bird special with my neighbors and my kids at 6 o', clock, or I can go to a late dinner and, you know, serve so many purposes. And prior to that, you know, I was at Gene Giorgetti's my whole life, kind of growing up. And, you know, he used to love the waiters and the culture and the way they treated people there was very cool, especially during the Jordan years. [00:05:45] Speaker B: Two Classics. Classics Gibson's in the last few years for me, has climbed up probably to the top of the list. The favorite steakhouses for me, like, there's so many good ones, but it just seems real Chicago. The food is super consistent. The service is, like, kind of Chicago, too. Yeah, it's just, like, enough pleasantries without being, like, full of, type of. You've. I don't know, it feels like the right level of, like, hospitality for me in there. And then you get an awesome meal every time. [00:06:16] Speaker A: Yep. You just sit in that patio and watch the world go by. [00:06:19] Speaker B: All right, if you're on a road trip, what are your go to snacks and drinks at the. The gas station when you stop? [00:06:28] Speaker A: You know, probably just simple like, you know, jerky and some soda. Just kind of keep it going. [00:06:32] Speaker B: Yeah. All right. Favorite Chicago show, street fest, concert venue or sporting event to attend? I understand you could probably answer all four of those, but what's the first thing that comes to mind when I say favorite Chicago happening to attend? [00:06:47] Speaker A: I love to just sneak into a Lollapalooza and then the. The Windy City smoke out. [00:06:53] Speaker B: I think those are too old for Lollapalooza, too. When you see smoke out, I'm good for the country. [00:06:58] Speaker A: The barbecue, like, I just feel like you need to keep going back. So, you know, what's going on is. [00:07:02] Speaker B: You know, that's true. [00:07:03] Speaker A: You know, the kids stay the same age, but. But you keep getting older and evolving. [00:07:08] Speaker B: Yeah. All right. If your colleagues described you with one word, what do you think it'd be? [00:07:14] Speaker A: I'm an optimist. [00:07:15] Speaker B: I like that, too. All right. Based on the buildings you own and operate, I'll go out on a limb and say that you like vintage buildings. Do you have a favorite building style? [00:07:29] Speaker A: You know, I love the. The history and the story behind the assets almost as much as. As the style. Just kind of looking at asset and saying, like, you know, we got to let it be what it is. And that guides the design and for the hotel, it guides the brand story. And in some ways, like, the unit mixes as well. But Lincoln park we just have a killer asset from 1893. Looks like a castle and takes you back to when the street looked very different at Clarkham Wrightwood. [00:08:05] Speaker B: It's funny to think about a building that's 120 years old in the context of what it looked like 120 years ago on the streetscape, because you get so it's hard to see past what's there right now. And like how, you know, we weren't around 120 years ago, but you see the old pictures, like, oh my. Like life in general was different and this building was still relevant in maybe in a different way. Maybe the same, you know, for some apartment buildings that I sell. It's like that building has lived as an apartment building the whole time. [00:08:35] Speaker A: Yes. [00:08:36] Speaker B: And is maintained. Relevancy is still, you know, you have to operate, upgrade systems. You have to keep up the envelope. There's things to do. But still certainly not functionally obsolete and in a lot of ways better than you could build it for today. [00:08:51] Speaker A: Right. [00:08:53] Speaker B: When you put like, I think in other markets across the country, a lot of the housing stock doesn't have. It's not as, you know, there's not the same like pre war vintage. You know, maybe it's 70s construction. 60s, 70s construction or newer. Um, it's just, it's cool. [00:09:09] Speaker A: It's cool. [00:09:10] Speaker B: You know, and it's. And it's cool to embrace it. It's cool to care. I think part of like, you have to just appreciate certain things about what we do. There's a lot on a day to day basis that can be kind of feel kind of like a grind. But if you step back and you're like, that building is cool and we did a good job with it. [00:09:29] Speaker A: Right, right. [00:09:30] Speaker B: It makes you feel good about the work. Where is your happy place? [00:09:37] Speaker A: It's. It's in southwest Michigan. Yeah, I mean, I'm pretty happy, you know, in Chicago too. [00:09:43] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:09:44] Speaker A: But I find it's like the Happy. [00:09:46] Speaker B: Gilmore happy place, you know, that's what I quite. You understood the question. All right, last one, man. Give us an up and comer in the Chicago real estate scene that you think deserves some recognition. [00:09:58] Speaker A: I have two colleagues that are young and solid. Jimmy Georgantis joined the team from Revantage doing finance accounting work for Blackstone and he left Blackstone. [00:10:12] Speaker B: I never heard of that. [00:10:12] Speaker A: Yeah, right. And he believes in the vision and what we're trying to build with the neighborhood hotel. And he's solid. And then Matt Shanley heads revenue and ops. He was actually living in Our hotel in Lincoln park needed a furnished extended stay apartment and raise his hand, said, I want to learn more. So he was able to. [00:10:34] Speaker B: Yeah, he's a stud. I got to know him a little bit better. The two. I don't know, Jimmy, but I trust you. But you know, Matt, I got to know a little bit as we were kind of discussing a deal or two or, you know, whatever. Having a catch up meeting, great guy. And it's also like when you surround yourself with people, like, that drives you too, you know, I got a couple of great guys that work with me right now. And it's like, keeps you energized. You want to do well by them too and everything, especially if they're a little younger also, like, you know, maybe a little bit. Same rationale for going to Lalapalu. Makes you feel like you're not just like an old stale dad, you know, and like stuck in your ways about how you do things. Awesome. All right. You're off the hot seat for the rapid fire, so feel free to ramble as much as you want. I like to just. I've been starting these all off the same, but I just think that it's. I don't know, it's the only way I know how to do it. I think that it provides some good context. So just. Why don't you start by telling us a little bit about growing up, Much as you care to share about that, maybe share an entrepreneurial story, you know, from being a young man or boy, and lead us to how and why you got into real estate. [00:11:52] Speaker A: Sure. [00:11:52] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:11:54] Speaker A: I grew up in northwest Indiana in Munster, so, you know, half hour south of the city. And my dad grew up kind of. [00:12:02] Speaker B: Like a suburb of Chicago. [00:12:03] Speaker A: Yeah, I feel like I grew up in Chicago. You know, my mom's family's from northwest Indiana. My dad was from the city and he worked downtown. And on the weekends he would have me either by his factory over by Midway or downtown in Lincoln Park. And I, like, loved going to the city and I always chose like, let's go downtown for dinner, you know, rather than see what's new in. In the region. [00:12:28] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:12:30] Speaker A: And all the excitement that came with that, you know, taking Lakeshore Drive up and seeing the buildings and, you know, watching construction. [00:12:36] Speaker B: And we talked to our mutual friend Kevin Werner about that too, and kind of like just the, the growing up vision of the skyline. It's a real, like, you take it for granted. Like you live, you know, you live. [00:12:48] Speaker A: Downtown now, you know, and we, Kevin and I, share that passion for for the city. And, you know, my, my kids have to, like, deal with me talking about the history all the time. Every time we drive by the, you know, the children's museum used to live in, you know, be in Lincoln park, you know, on Clark street, and all of my experiences that are so, you know, fond. [00:13:08] Speaker B: Yeah, that's awesome. So you spend a lot of time in the city. Where'd you go to school? Were you good, you know, was. Were you a good student grade wise? Like, what did school represent to you growing up? Do you have like a neighborhood hustle, like mowing lawns or, you know, selling widgets or lemonade or whatever, Anything like that? What was. Was there like an entrepreneurial inkling back then? [00:13:36] Speaker A: I, you know, I think I did every, you know, typical kid entrepreneurial job, you know, shoveling snow and then spray painting people's addresses on the curbs. You know, it was just always kind of with me. And I loved the, the challenge and the interaction and, you know, I didn't want to go work at the park district for whatever minimum wage was at the time when I could go create and. And sell. [00:14:05] Speaker B: Yeah, I did both growing up. I did the minimum wage job, actually. [00:14:11] Speaker A: Did two of them. [00:14:13] Speaker B: And a lot of perspective gained from that. And also, just like, I also came. You appreciate that work doesn't mean the same thing to everybody, you know, and some people, you know, I think it's like, either some people work to live, some people live to work. And like, you know, I fall more in, you know, the latter camp these days that, you know, work is a big part of my, I guess, identity and. But like, I also, it's like, it's so fun. I had like a job at the school district where we just did yard work in the, in the summer. And like, you know, the guys I worked with were awesome. And it, you know, it's just good to have the frame of reference for both, for sure. Was there anybody you point to a person or two, or, you know, even if you want to answer, like an experience or two, that was a segue into the real estate business or you think was kind of like influential and you going that direction. [00:15:09] Speaker A: So I have a lot of real estate in my family. [00:15:12] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:15:12] Speaker A: My uncle in Indianapolis was a. Is a developer and he would build power centers and, and, you know, drugstores, and I'd get to go, you know, drive by and have a frame of reference like the, the new power center, you know, off the 65 and on the way to Indianapolis. Yeah. So I'd be able to get to, like, see, touch, feel some projects. And I also knew that he was able to create a great life. So real estate was. Was, you know, something early on I said that could be a great path for me. [00:15:44] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:15:45] Speaker A: I didn't know if it was industrial, office, retail. I had to go figure that out on my own, which. Which fortunately I was able to do, you know, after college, which was at the University of Kansas. [00:15:59] Speaker B: Okay, so you went to Kansas. I'm sure that that was no fun at all. They bad. Good basketball, too, probably, back then. I mean, just fun school, you know, in very unoriginal fashion. You were a Midwest kid that went to a Big Ten or Big 12 school and then landed in Chicago thereafter. Or was there a step in between where you did not go to Chicago. [00:16:21] Speaker A: I didn't want to be, you know, anywhere else. [00:16:23] Speaker B: Yeah. Okay, so you came to Chicago, got. [00:16:25] Speaker A: Right into real estate, came to Chicago, met with a friend's dad who helped me understand, you know, you've got to break it down into industrial, office, retail. You pick a major. [00:16:39] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:16:40] Speaker A: And then the other side of the page, you know, do you want to do, you know, landlord work or tenant work? [00:16:45] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:16:46] Speaker A: And after I had that framework, I was able to say, okay, well, let's go talk to some people. And, you know, an introduction turned into another introduction. And, you know, I think the day that I was offered an opportunity to go work at Collier's Industrial, I had made the decision that I wanted to do downtown office brokerage. [00:17:07] Speaker B: Okay. [00:17:08] Speaker A: And. And I stuck to that plan, even though the industrial direction could have been interesting. [00:17:14] Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, I think about that a lot, too, because when I got into real estate, I did not even, like. I talked to my uncle who's in Denver, and he was in multifamily business and started as a broker and owned and operated, you know, some of his own stuff, and a big management company in. In urban Denver. And he had, you know, he had given me a little bit of the same direction. It sounds like you got from your friend's dad, where you, like, you have to pick a food group, especially in a big market. It's like, you know, you can't. You can't do a lot of. Or a little bit of a lot. You kind of have to, you know, special. A lot of. A little. Right. Have a niche and. But I don't know if I just like, brainwash myself from, like, really loving the apartment industry after doing it for about 15 years and getting to know everybody in it and stuff, or if it's just A really fortuitous thing to happen. But when I interviewed at Marcus and Millichap, I interviewed with folks that did kind of every different food group. And I ended up starting with a guy named Jamie Clow who did apartments. And it was more of just like an. Like a personality or personalities clicked and, like, timing was good for him and. But I'm just. I'm very happy that I started in apartments. But it's interesting, like, when you think back at, like, what that moment looked like, if I would have clicked with somebody that did right. Something, would I be as passionate about office stuff today? I don't know. [00:18:40] Speaker A: Well, that's why you need to meet a ton of different potential mentors and talk to people and figure out how to, you know, land in the right spot. [00:18:47] Speaker B: It's very true. You know, if there's, you know, if there's somebody kind of like, at that point in their career where they're deciding which path to go down, don't. Don't be cavalier about those conversations, because the more people that you can get to know, and get to know not only, like, that product type, like, what's going on with it today, what's the, you know, what's the forecast for it or whatever, but, like, get to know how it fits what you want to do, because, like, there's, you know, retail, financing, management, brokerage. There's just a lot of different careers within real estate that are. They share some similarities, but the skill sets required to be effective at them have some overlap. There's also some distinct differences. So if you want to be in real estate, make sure you kind of pick the right lane, because, you know, and I know that the first few years of it are the toughest, and you don't want to, you know, I don't want to say, throw those away because experience is experience, but you don't want to go all out on something that you end up pivoting away from because, you know, there's really not a marketplace for what you do where transaction velocity is not there enough, or it's just an oversaturated segment, like, spend a little bit of time on the front end to make sure that you understand what those years are, because they're really important. Few years to get started. And if you have to have those three years, you know, two or three times, you're gonna get burnt out before you get your legs underneath you. You know, I don't know. A little bit of a tangent. Sorry, nobody asked me for that. What about, you know, something I was thinking about this weekend when I had put together this kind of like, outline or some ideas for questions is, you know, as my kids are getting a little bit older, I'm thinking about, like, kids, things from my childhood that I, that I did or priorities that were instilled that I'm trying to do the same with. Even though it's, you know, it's some things that are different about growing up in Chicago than Iowa. Are there anything, is there anything about your, like, how you look at being a dad that you remember from back then in Munster that you're really working on here in Chicago and you know, maybe something that came natural and easy for you or something that like, you have to kind of like work to prioritize a little bit more in fatherhood here. [00:21:11] Speaker A: Well, the, the way that I remember going to work with my dad, even if it was just to drive a, you know, a forklift or kind of be in the factory, he was in the box business. My kids come to the hotels and they're, you know, they're. [00:21:25] Speaker B: I see them sometimes. [00:21:26] Speaker A: They're cleaning base with housekeeping. Yeah, I love, you know, and my wife's an entrepreneur and the kids are very much, you know, present with her both on social media and, and in the office. So they're getting, you know, a front row seat to it. [00:21:41] Speaker B: That's cool. [00:21:42] Speaker A: And then, you know, as I mature as a parent, it's just been more about dialing back to like, maybe the family should have some, some core values or some things like that. We, like, keep it simple for them. [00:21:53] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:21:53] Speaker A: In terms of just, you know, how you treat people and how you show up on time and like, do the little things really well. [00:21:58] Speaker B: Yeah, that's a good answer. And I, I've observed that you're like, your kids are involved in the business too and see it firsthand. Doesn't hurt that you and your wife both have cool businesses that, you know, it's. It's also like not a boring thing to take them along to, you know, to, to touch and feel the real estate. I understand that your wife is in, I think, design and fashion type stuff too. So that's like they're two, I'm sure exciting things for younger kids to, to see as opposed to like, our girls. [00:22:33] Speaker A: Are just at a great age. They're 10 and 8, so they still. [00:22:36] Speaker B: Think you're cool too. [00:22:37] Speaker A: They're sponges. Yeah, they love dad. [00:22:40] Speaker B: So you mentioned that you started at Colliers, you stuck to your guns. [00:22:44] Speaker A: I started at Trans. So when I had the opportunity to go To Colliers. I said no. I've chosen downtown office, which led me to Transwestern. [00:22:55] Speaker B: Okay, so you did downtown office, broker, tenant rep, landlord rep, tenant rep. Okay, so for how long? [00:23:02] Speaker A: About 10 years. [00:23:03] Speaker B: Oh, that's a good run. [00:23:05] Speaker A: But I saw your LinkedIn post. Congrats on a billion in sales. [00:23:09] Speaker B: Thanks, dude. [00:23:11] Speaker A: The trajectory was also amazing. Just to see the growth kind of year in, year out, you know, pretty nice, consistent jumps. Yeah, but the first couple years in brokerage, I think you said, like, zero, zilch. [00:23:23] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. [00:23:23] Speaker A: Not in the. The columns, but, like, cutting your teeth as a broker. You know, those. Those first few years, I mean, that's. You got to learn how to stack up wins and appreciate them. It was like every. [00:23:36] Speaker B: Every cold call and big time that I. To be honest, like, I usually deflect, like, compliments like that or like, achievements, like, it makes. I don't. I don't know. I don't like to. This one, I've really kind of like, soaked in a little bit more, and it made me a little bit, like, retrospective about getting there. And when I looked back at, you know, I lived very frugally the first few years of doing it. Like, I kind of approached it in my head, like, it was like grad school, you know, Like, I wasn't. Wasn't going to make a lot, but I was going to learn a lot, and I knew it was what I wanted to do. After I got started with it, I kind of saw the path to it being a little bit more of a business. And then the mindset kind of changed where, like, all right, you're just. You're starting a business. You know, it's not like you're doing a career where you're underpaid, which is what it can feel like. You know, I left a job that I was making a lot more money than I did in the first few years of doing this, but I'm like, all right, if you're starting your business, like, you have to start it somewhere. Those things help me kind of, like, trick myself, like, have the mindset to stick with it. But also, like, when people reach out, oftentimes I feel like they want to, like, skip forward to year, like five. And then when you start to make a little bit of money, you have some flexibility in your life. You have some relationships, you know, and just. You don't get to do that. Maybe some people do, you know, if they have some family or something that can connect them. But even still, you don't. Even if that's the case, then you still have to form your own, like, knowledge base. [00:25:08] Speaker A: Right. You have to put your time. [00:25:10] Speaker B: Yeah. The other thing that doing that kind of like doing the post I put out, where it showed year over year and cumulative was like, generally I've grown in number of deals and transaction size and stuff. But you see when you look at that, it's not a straight line business. If you look at it year over year, things really significant can happen in the market that changes how easy or hard it is to get deals done. But also just like, I try to maintain like, consistency in the different buckets of like, you know, proposals, listings under contract. But. But inevitably, like, you get really busy with a bunch of stuff under contract and you really focused and it's time consuming to get them done and like, maybe the inventory falls behind. So it's just like when I look at those, a year that I did $170 million versus a year that I did $85 million, I was not working twice as high hard. It just like things were clicking. So when you started as a broker, you know, you did it for 10 years, you had some success doing it. When and why did you pivot to the principal side? What did you see as the opportunity? What was like, kind of what was the itch that you wanted to scratch in it? [00:26:30] Speaker A: So you think the idea of being on the principal side is always there and exciting? [00:26:35] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:26:36] Speaker A: As an office broker, you know, I knew how to do like, very specific, kind of help the, the CEO find the space, negotiate the lease, be there to service the client, you know, throughout the term. [00:26:49] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:26:50] Speaker A: If they needed to, you know, downsize or expand or give a referral, you just had to really appreciate that client relationship. [00:26:57] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:26:58] Speaker A: And my tenant rep team, we had some, you know, big anchor clients. But then I wanted to do as many deals as I could, you know, as many singles and doubles. So I would do about 20 deals a year and I'd get to help the CEO shop for space and I'd get to, you know, get a peek into other people's businesses and how they ran it and what worked. [00:27:19] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:27:20] Speaker A: I also got to see how landlords were bringing hospitality into the office buildings in a way that really could change the game. You know, Prudential Plaza is the first one that comes to mind. You know, they added an incredible roof deck and they started building spec suites. The company leaders would show up and they would quickly realize, you know, I can imagine, you know, my culture growing here using the roof deck. Oh, by the way, this isn't raw space. That I can have delivered in 12 to 18 months. This is a furnished spec suite. And those pieces allowed buildings like Prudential to see like, big absorption in the east loop, which is the furthest from the trains. [00:28:04] Speaker B: Right, right. [00:28:05] Speaker A: So kind of recognizing how the buildings were changing, you know, made me ready to explain that when I was meeting a friend who was, you know, putting a team together to lead Equity Commonwealth. [00:28:21] Speaker B: Okay. Yeah. [00:28:22] Speaker A: So we met for, for coffee. I thought maybe Cushman Wakefield could be there for, you know, services somewhere along the line. And he called me a few weeks later and said, I think we did someone with your perspective on the asset. [00:28:34] Speaker B: Management team to stay in the office. Right. I mean, Equity Commonwealth. [00:28:38] Speaker A: So I left Cushman Wakefield and I went to Equity Commonwealth. We had taken over the portfolio of a publicly traded REIT based in Newton, Massachusetts. And we, it felt like overnight, you know, management changed and, and we were given the reins of the company. [00:28:59] Speaker B: For a lot of real estate. [00:29:00] Speaker A: For a lot of real estate. [00:29:01] Speaker B: So how long did you do that? [00:29:03] Speaker A: I was there about four and a half years. [00:29:05] Speaker B: Okay. [00:29:06] Speaker A: We started with 156 buildings. When I left, there were 10. And it was office, but also industrial, retail. There were, you know, some, some vineyards. It was a really mixed bag and pretty eclectic. We sold a lot of real estate and we repositioned a lot of office buildings to, to go get them, you know, leased up and, and sold. [00:29:32] Speaker B: I mean, that's a very, like, that, that, that part of the, the kind of like life cycle of a real estate deal is really important. You know, I don't have to tell you, but when you're, you have that, that much real estate, that different real estate, and then, you know, at a large scale, you know, and you're tasked with disposing the assets at the highest price the market will bear. You have to get them to stabilization. So there's a lot of leasing. You have to position them in the market, do anything to them that you need to do to make them as attractive as possible, you know, for first impression type stuff, but then also make them very salable through the due diligence process. So you're selling 100, whatever, 146 deals or something like that in four and a half years, you're seeing a lot of, like, there's just a lot of deal flow to that. You know, you really kind of probably sharpened your sword more than you realized during that time. Well, it was like how to work through real estate. [00:30:29] Speaker A: It was like the gift of like learning how to be an owner. And also looking at every dollar spent and trying to understand is there, is there a payback there? And also, you know, big, big picture, you know, market factors and how that affects you, is it worth playing in this market or time to sell? [00:30:50] Speaker B: Yeah. And so after you guys got to the, you know, after you got to the point where you had 10 buildings and I assume, you know, so when you said you left, is that when you launched Neighborhood? [00:30:59] Speaker A: I had, I had, I had a little bit of a head start that, that it felt like we were selling our assets and there may not be an opportunity to go redeploy the capital and create that bigger company in the image that we were targeting. So I was able to look and say now would be my time to go build something entrepreneurial. It's always been in my head. Now I could go execute on it. [00:31:29] Speaker B: So what tell us about that? I mean, like, how did the idea, why don't you take a step back and talk about what neighborhood hotels, what you do, how you're different and then I'll ask you some follow up questions about it. [00:31:46] Speaker A: So the Neighborhood Hotel is our boutique hotel brand. We deliver a hotel experience that involves, you know, some of the best components of a short term rental like, like kitchens and washer dryers. And the goal is to have locations in the center of the neighborhood. So, you know, think along the Marathon route in Lincoln Park. Our Lincoln Park. [00:32:15] Speaker B: Good way to put it. [00:32:16] Speaker A: Our Lincoln park location is on Clark street where our hotel doesn't have to carry the expense load of the food and beverage operations because like walk next door to the Wiener Circle and get a snack or go to Francis's Deli for breakfast. [00:32:32] Speaker B: How many times have you been there? [00:32:33] Speaker A: It's fantastic. [00:32:35] Speaker B: So hot dog with a side of harassment, you know, any time of day. Yeah, it's a very fun experience. So you. I don't know. So how did the idea of this hybrid, you know, this, this is like a new, you know, we talked about food groups in real estate. This is a new product type where it's, you're a hybrid between. [00:32:59] Speaker A: I was able to see how asset classes were blending okay with office and hospitality. And I realized that office is a tough asset class, especially when you need to go take a full floor and turn it into amenity space. And you know, the cost to build out a spec suite. So I knew I didn't want to play in office. And as I was traveling for work, I realized, you know, the, the Starwood points weren't worth it. If I have to go stay at A state of Weston. Walk across the street to 1735 Market in Philly and then be upstairs in a budget meeting all day. It's like, these cities have so much to offer. [00:33:33] Speaker B: You didn't get the vibe that. [00:33:34] Speaker A: You don't get the vibe. Like, next thing you know, you're on an airplane. [00:33:36] Speaker B: Dude, that's interesting. I, I didn't think of it that, you know, I, I don't know, I thought you were just buying the real estate you wanted to buy. I didn't think about it so much from, like, the customer experience of it. So when you saw the location on Clark and Wrightwood for those, I mean, I assume that Chicago real estate audience that listens to this knows that it's main on main and one of the best locations of the city. So what was it about that? Was it, was it the building style? Is it like the zoning? I mean, I guess walk me through, like, how the acquisition criteria kind of like falls into line. Like, do you have to start with the zoning or you start with a size building or you look like. [00:34:20] Speaker A: Well, it's a good question. Definitely want to get there, but let me. So, so traveling to Philly, you know, I had a friend saying, like, go eat at this awesome restaurant, Zahav, and go to Rival Brothers Coffee. And yeah, my city center experience wasn't allowing me to do that. So I found a curated Airbnb to try in a neighborhood called Fishtown. But, you know, airbnb, when it's not done right, it's like someone else's stuff. It's just not totally dialed in. So, you know, that was the spark to say we could do this legally. It's a hotel. Incorporate the best of the short term rental. Find locations in the center of these neighborhoods. And in Chicago, you know, we have a list of, you know, 15 neighborhoods. We're in Lincoln park, we're on Taylor street, and, you know, right near the Illinois Medical District. But think commercial corridors with buildings of, of some scale. Yeah, you know, ideally it's 30 units, but it could go up or down from there. And we need zoning, you know, C or higher. In Lincoln park, we worked with the alderman, you know, Michelle Smith. [00:35:33] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:35:34] Speaker A: And she understood the concept. She said this is where, you know, an apartment style hotel belongs on Clark Street. It's not in a neighborhood building, you know, with residential zoning. And she supported us to go get zoning change and then a special use permit. [00:35:55] Speaker B: But if you don't have to insert those steps in the process to take a lot of the uncertainty out of you know, market dynamics and such. Right. So if you can walk into zoning. [00:36:04] Speaker A: That works, then you're one step closer to delivering. [00:36:07] Speaker B: Yeah, right. I guess. Let me take a step back. And I appreciate you taking a step back when I had asked about your acquisition criteria, but when you were starting like with the Lincoln park one, you know, what year was that? [00:36:23] Speaker A: 2019. [00:36:24] Speaker B: Okay. So, you know, Airbnb was an established thing, but it's, you know, it's significantly more so now. I think more people consider it as an option when they travel or prefer it as an option when they travel. Did you have it, did you have an issue like with, or challenge with, like adoption? Like, were people shopping for a Hotel on booking.com or Expedia or whatever, you know, the best platform is, and then they were just finding yours? Or did you have to like, sell the idea of here's what we, here's what we are? Because I know it, because I've known you and I follow the social media and, you know, I'm in Lincoln park, we see this happening. I've known what it's been since the beginning, but I'm not sure if I was going to Fishtown and in Philly, whether I would have even ever come across it or like, understood it as an option. So, like, what about, like the adoption of the customer? Was that a challenge at the beginning? [00:37:23] Speaker A: That's, that's a good question. And we, we knew there was some downside protection in the business model because when you have a kitchen and washer dryer and it's apartment style. [00:37:36] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:37:37] Speaker A: You have the, the ability to do a 12 month lease. [00:37:40] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:37:41] Speaker A: You know, that's not going to. [00:37:42] Speaker B: So that was their backstopping. People tell us to go jump. [00:37:45] Speaker A: There's a high. There's a plan B. Yeah, plan B. So that, that helps when you're investing your own money and, and, you know, friends and family money into a project. It also helps that it's main and main in Lincoln Park. So, you know, it's a really, really good asset if for some reason the customers aren't there. [00:38:05] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:38:08] Speaker A: But we knew Lincoln park had a lack of hotels. We knew that no matter how big your house is, there's always, you know, extra guests that you'd rather have a block away. You know, you've got DePaul and, you know, the, the health system. So we had a pretty good idea that it would be a success. [00:38:25] Speaker B: Yeah. And you. So from there, the next one was in Grand Beach. Right. Or am I mistaken? [00:38:33] Speaker A: The second one was in grand beach. But With Lincoln park, we opened our doors in March of 2020. [00:38:40] Speaker B: Nailed it. [00:38:41] Speaker A: Yes. [00:38:42] Speaker B: So, yeah, awesome time for hotels, awesome time for real estate deals in general. [00:38:48] Speaker A: You know, March, March 15th. [00:38:50] Speaker B: That'll put some hair in the face. [00:38:51] Speaker A: I remember, like standing in a suite, like, trying to help this woman from Minnesota, like, get the WI fi to work and we've got masks on and we're staring at each other and it was all really interesting so that we were just in survival mode with that first hotel. And we went to plan B, which was to take two floors and do 12 month leases. [00:39:12] Speaker B: Okay. [00:39:14] Speaker A: And Matt Shanley, our head of revenue and ops, was one of those renters. And that was the guy who raised his hand and said, I want to learn more about the business. [00:39:25] Speaker B: So when you. There's this, as everybody had during the beginning of COVID like, there's this oh, shit moment. You had just delivered your first. You'd done a lot of things right up until that. And this thing happens. It's like outside of your control, outside of every model that you could have possibly planned for. So when you're in survival mode like that. So, okay, you had, you had a backstop idea to rent conventionally, but you're still renting smaller apartments in a context of, you know, people pivoted around that time to wanting bigger apartments, spot for home, office, spot for a peloton, whatever. And you still had a meaningful part of the deal that you were renting short term. So I kind of, you know, I kind of know who ended up settling into some of that type of housing. But I guess, how did you find your way with the rest of it? How did you get by for that, you know, four or five months when everybody was in oh, shit mode. [00:40:30] Speaker A: So in, in some ways, like Covid helped a percent percent of our customer base, like, realize that, you know, they don't need a front desk. [00:40:42] Speaker B: Oh, I see. Yeah. [00:40:43] Speaker A: Realize that they like to have a unit with a kitchen because you can walk to the farmer's market, come back, make breakfast. [00:40:49] Speaker B: They're not using the common amenities of a hotel. [00:40:53] Speaker A: Or if you didn't know how to use grubhub before, you know, you figured out real quick during COVID when you didn't want to see or touch anybody. [00:41:00] Speaker B: Yeah. So some of those things ended up being a strength and there was enough of the market. And as I understand, I think there was also like, you know, like, traveling healthcare provider, like, need and stuff like that. Right. [00:41:14] Speaker A: I mean, yeah, people got in their. [00:41:15] Speaker B: Cars or like you had somebody in your Family you were nervous about. So when the kid came back from college, you know, you didn't want him to be with grandma or something. [00:41:24] Speaker A: A producer from ABC News that drove from New York and, you know, took a space for a month at like $12,000. That was an awesome moment we had. You know, I'm coming back to see my family, and I need to rent a furnished place. This is the best location, and the design is suite. And, you know, the decision there is not about price. [00:41:45] Speaker B: Yeah, well, it's also like confidence inspiring when you have this new thing and you have this radical disruption and you're like, all right, well, we figured it out, you know, so once things smooth out, operations should smooth out. So. [00:41:58] Speaker A: And you asked about Grand Beach. [00:42:00] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:42:02] Speaker A: A couple friends with homes up there, you know, kept saying, you got to come to Michigan. And eventually that turned into, there is an old inn right by my house in grand beach that you should go check out. And it was a weird time to do real estate deals. And somehow it just, you know, it made sense. We had the construction crew from Lincoln park that was able to go out to southwest Michigan. Everybody, like, like, helped with a little piece or a little piece of information that helped us, like, decide it was the right decision. We had people that lived in Grand Beach. Yeah, we had people who lived in southwest Michigan. It just all added up to taking an old Roadside in from 1914 with great history and repositioning it as the neighborhood hotel. Grand Beach. It's also southwest Michigan has helped me learn how to operate on a market. So one day when we go to south Florida or another market, we'll have, you know, it dialed in. [00:43:06] Speaker B: So was that in like summer or fall of 2020? [00:43:10] Speaker A: That was. That was in fall of 2020 and 21. So yeah, we moved from like. [00:43:16] Speaker B: But that was also, I mean, you were identify, like there's some identification of an opportunity there, because that was when northwest Indiana and southwest Michigan all up and down the lake, had a. Had a boom. I mean, honestly, you know, we bought our place in Long Beach, Indiana in fall of 2020. And because we just, we were like, you know, we didn't just buy it for during COVID We wanted to live in the city long term. But when, you know, it's nice to lucky to be able to have a chance to kind of live a different lifestyle too, with the kids and stuff when we get out of the city. So there was a massive boom in that market too. There's scarcity of housing available. There's like, our friends are staying in it in like a month. There's, there's. I think you have like kind of a coach house style there too. But there's like a need for housing and people don't necessarily want to live. You know, the experience in living in, you know, New Buffalo is cool, but this is more like, say in the neighborhood, you know, you're right in the center of where there's a bunch of single family homes or half a block from the lake. So that one strikes me as just like also very in vogue at that time. Like so. [00:44:29] Speaker A: So I grew up going to Michiana. New Buffalo. [00:44:33] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:44:33] Speaker A: And then as an adult, I realized how hard it was to rent a vacation home. It was expensive, seven night minimum. And wasn't that great? [00:44:41] Speaker B: And the towns kind of go like this on their willingness to like to do Airbnb. Like New Buffalo, there was a big scare, I think. I don't think they ended up passing it where they banned Airbnb. I know in Long beach you can't do any short. [00:44:53] Speaker A: There's restrictions. [00:44:54] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:44:55] Speaker A: You know, just so if you have. [00:44:57] Speaker B: A bed and breakfast. [00:44:58] Speaker A: Correct. [00:44:58] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:44:59] Speaker A: In, in grand beach has an amazing history. I mean, this property was the training camp for James Braddock, the heavyweight fighter when he fought Joe Lewis at Comiskey Park. [00:45:09] Speaker B: Oh. [00:45:09] Speaker A: So there was a story there and there was a Grand Beach. It has a, like a very tight community of Southside Chicago. [00:45:15] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:45:15] Speaker A: Folks that have houses there. So it fit into where we wanted to go with, with the brand. [00:45:20] Speaker B: Yeah. I still look at that also as being like, you know, certainly at least like Chicago. It's like Chicago adjacent. You know, it's still kind of Chicago. [00:45:31] Speaker A: People stay on so much of time, so. [00:45:33] Speaker B: Yeah. Right. There's so much of a dynamic of Chicago folks there that incorporated in their lives. But also you're an hour away. [00:45:41] Speaker A: Right. [00:45:41] Speaker B: So you're bringing your same trades and everything. You're bringing the same crew that did it and urban Lincoln park to southwest Michigan. [00:45:48] Speaker A: At that property, it's like about 20% of the customers are repeat customers. And that's awesome. Like, we want you to use the hotel as like the vacation home you don't have to own. [00:45:58] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:45:59] Speaker A: So you can book the same suite three times over the course of the summer. And you know, you don't have to have the. Everything that comes with home ownership. [00:46:07] Speaker B: Yeah. Talk about something that I think is cool about your brand is, you know, there's very thoughtful. There's thoughtful branding. We talked a lot about that. A little bit. I think it was actually before we Started filming. There's a thoughtful branding, but talk about, like, the. How the renovation finishes, furnishings, even layouts. Like, how the design and, like, execution of the finishes. Like, it's clearly a focus. So I guess, like, what do you focus on? What's important? What do. What have you realized that the customers really care about or don't care about? Like, talk to us about, like, the. The execution of them. [00:46:52] Speaker A: So. So some, you know, brand development has just come, like, organic and is. Yeah. Just happened in a really nice way. [00:47:01] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:47:01] Speaker A: Some, you know, other parts of the business are a slog. Like, you know, the COVID then supply chain, and then interest rates, all the above. But I was meeting with friends, like, trying to vet out the neighborhood hotel business plan, and I went to go see a friend that was in marketing at AJ Capital, and she said, you know, if you. If you go do this, reach out to Marley Cruiser at Rebel House Designs, it would be great. [00:47:30] Speaker B: That name's also, like, a cool market. Marley Cruiser. [00:47:33] Speaker A: Yeah. At Rebel House. [00:47:35] Speaker B: Just cool. Yeah. [00:47:36] Speaker A: She was starting her business the same time I was starting mine. She's designed every hotel, and I haven't had to. To think about, you know, what color the wall should be. [00:47:47] Speaker B: So she takes care of all the interior design. [00:47:49] Speaker A: It's. It's been her vision, and she's just nailed it. She's got a special talent. And, you know, I walked into Lincoln Park Hotel and I saw, like, you know, the color of the walls was, like, millennial pink, but it was, like, the right choices at the right time to embrace the old and then use enough of what's happening now. [00:48:08] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:48:09] Speaker A: Grand beach, you know, feels like a forest retreat with a really great sleep experience. [00:48:14] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. [00:48:15] Speaker A: You know, New Buffalo is. [00:48:16] Speaker B: And they're kind of like lower strung buildings, like, in the forest. They're dark. It's got a vibe. [00:48:20] Speaker A: It's got cool. It's got a great vibe. [00:48:22] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:48:23] Speaker A: Little Italy Hotel. That was the former Italian American Sports hall of Fame. And, you know, Marley said, I did research into what was going on on Taylor Street. When was it booming? What, years? And then what was happening in Italy at that time, and use that to guide the design. So that's, you know, she's been awesome, the copywriting. You know, I saw a Buddy post on LinkedIn that his wife was a copywriter, and I reached out to, you know, the. The Culex, and Meg has, like, the. The first time she put pen to paper, like, describing my vision, it was just. It was there. [00:49:02] Speaker B: It's kind of fun to, like, do That a la carte the way you want to do it, who you want to work with. You know, you pick the bet, like pick people that you're friendly with or they come well recommended. And then it's like you're, you know, when you run a nimble shop, a lot of, a lot of your even like daily experience and a lot of your success, your business ends up being folks that you decide to like, hire. [00:49:30] Speaker A: Every dollar matters. It's just been like incredible to bootstrap and to figure it out in a nice way. The, the logo design like just worked. [00:49:40] Speaker B: Yeah. What about things that you did, things that you did that didn't, that didn't add value or that you or. And then maybe the other way is like, is there anything about your first project or two that you then you learned from? And you said, well, our customer really wants this too. Like anything that you can think of on either or both sides. [00:50:07] Speaker A: Well, we're continuing to learn and now we have data to see. Say, you know, what the mix should be. Studios versus one bedrooms. Or does a studio need a range? Or can it be a two burner hot plate? Or is there a way to put an air fryer into a. [00:50:26] Speaker B: Is there a one size fits all answer to those things or does it depend on where you're at? [00:50:30] Speaker A: Well, we have a new ground up project and that'll be the first time we can truly design what's in the box. Yeah, but with adaptive reuse, you know, you can have a vision and put thought behind it, but you have to let the spaces kind of be what they are, which ends up resulting in the unit count. [00:50:50] Speaker B: Yeah. How about. So did people want like with studios and ones, did people want more space or were they getting by with less space? Just Chicago as an example. [00:51:01] Speaker A: So our average length of stay is about four nights. [00:51:04] Speaker B: Okay. [00:51:06] Speaker A: We, you know, have European size appliances. I think the, the range is less important. But people like to boil pasta on a two burner hot plate. [00:51:16] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:51:18] Speaker A: The washer dryer. Even if people don't use it, they want to know it's there. Because if you have kids you can go with clean clothes or they go. [00:51:25] Speaker B: For a run and you know that's exactly the kids. It's like you've thought you've packed enough on a vacation and you've been like, you've been surprised that all of a. [00:51:35] Speaker A: Sudden you're out of clothes and the customers want. We have like Cisco Meraki, like Great Wi Fi, YouTube TV. You turn on the TV and it's. [00:51:44] Speaker B: It'S There go to your show that you left at home. [00:51:46] Speaker A: It's just dialed in in the right way. [00:51:48] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:51:49] Speaker A: And we do. It's about 2200 room nights a month. [00:51:53] Speaker B: Okay. Yeah. [00:51:54] Speaker A: And when you look at the reviews, the same things keep, like the same themes keep popping up. You know, every time I needed something, like I turned and it was there. Which is just awesome to, to read because there's not too much stuff in each unit. It's, it's meant to be like just what you need. Like great, great coffee, just what you need. Maybe, you know, barbecue or reheat leftovers or. [00:52:21] Speaker B: Well, it's really hard to be well reviewed these, these days too. You know, it's just especially online. [00:52:27] Speaker A: Right, right. We try, we try like treat, treat the customers how they want to be treated. [00:52:32] Speaker B: Was there anything, you know, when I was on your website kind of prepping for this, you've received a lot of recognition, like positive press from a lot of different, like seemingly like the who's who of like travel publications and like architectural digests and stuff like that. Was there anything, any article that you ever read or, or recognition that you got that like you remember kind of patting yourself on the back or not. I don't mean in like a, that it was just, it felt nice or that like you realize this, this really. [00:53:04] Speaker A: Is something the, the TripAdvisor reviews are very cool. And as we dial in the ops, it's amazing to see people talk about the, the staff and the service because there's, there's no, you know, there's no humans, there's no front desk. [00:53:25] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:53:26] Speaker A: So yeah, we're delivering service in a way via text message, which is how I want to receive information. [00:53:32] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:53:32] Speaker A: In a way that, that feels natural and prompt. And you know, we have, we just added two customer service agents through Staff Folio. [00:53:43] Speaker B: Oh yeah. Gabe, huh? [00:53:44] Speaker A: Yeah, through Gabe and Alec and the podcast guest. They, they answered like 600 calls last month. About 70 hours of customer service. And that was all done in house. [00:54:01] Speaker B: And what I am, what I didn't fully understand about. So the business, it's Gabe Horstick and Alec Greenberg from, from stafffolio. They started. [00:54:12] Speaker A: I think it's in the Philippines. [00:54:14] Speaker B: The Philippines. Okay. So it started a full kind of customer customer service and more. It's total underway of selling it because they think that they're capable of doing like some accounting bookkeeping type stuff and they do a lot. But you're also, you're just, you're, you're hiring a very like high level person there as well, and it's just more cost effective. [00:54:37] Speaker A: Right, right. We have two like committed team members out there and it's really helped us like dial in our standard operating procedures. [00:54:45] Speaker B: Cool. [00:54:48] Speaker A: And that's just critical to like respond to people fast and you know, have it written down how you address a problem. And what happens if a customer needs a credit or a refund or, you know, if check ins delayed on the front end? Well, then let's give them a late check out of the back end. Yeah, so. So all of that is a written process at this point and they follow the playbook. So that's been great. [00:55:11] Speaker B: That's awesome. I know, you know, I know it's a brand that you're passionate about growing. Like what are some of your goals for growth of the brand? And also when you're talking about that, you know, keep in mind we got a lot of brokers listening and people who, you know, also. But also, I guess potential customers or you know, investors, whatever. Like, where do you want to be? You know, where do you want to be in your goals? And then where do you physically want, where do you want the neighborhood hotels to be? [00:55:43] Speaker A: Well, we have a, we have a big kind of 10 year vision, but right now the team is focused on our three year goal. [00:55:51] Speaker B: Okay. [00:55:52] Speaker A: So we have 73, you know, units between one and three bedroom. Right now the goal is to get to 400 in Chicago in three years and 150 in Southwest Michigan. [00:56:06] Speaker B: And so where do you want them to be in Chicago? Because, you know, there's a lot of neighborhoods that I, I would think of. It's funny how often I say neighborhoods too when I describe a brand. It's cool. I know it's not an accent, but I could, I could think of a lot that I think would be fitting for it, but you know, much better than me. Where, where as, as specific as you want to be. Even if you say like I want to be, you know, I'll probably take one from me. I want to be in Wicker park and I want to be on the 14 or 1500 or 1600 block maybe. [00:56:34] Speaker A: Right, well, well, the right size building is like ideally it can be about 30 suites. [00:56:44] Speaker B: Okay. [00:56:44] Speaker A: You know, like, like Taylor street puts us in the center of a neighborhood. [00:56:48] Speaker B: So was end up being like 15 or 20,000 square feet gross. [00:56:51] Speaker A: Yeah, 20. 20 or higher. [00:56:53] Speaker B: Yeah. Okay. [00:56:55] Speaker A: And you know, we know we want to be in Streeterville because we can anchor to the medical community there. [00:57:00] Speaker B: Totally. [00:57:01] Speaker A: You know, we, we think there's a future near the Obama Presidential center in. In Hyde Park. [00:57:06] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:57:07] Speaker A: I've been trying hard to get up and down the Milwaukee corridor. [00:57:10] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:57:11] Speaker A: From river west up to Avondale. You know, it just kind of goes back to where. Where's the cta? Where the. Where the lines. Where can you get real zoning? And do you have to take an existing asset and turn it into a neighborhood hotel? You know, can it be a office to residential conversion? [00:57:36] Speaker B: Can you pivot. Can you pivot from apartment use? I guess the zoning's probably never really. [00:57:43] Speaker A: It's. It's zoning and then also just the phasing of rolling the building from traditional. [00:57:50] Speaker B: Like, it's hard to kind of cohabitate between, like, the. [00:57:54] Speaker A: And, you know, other locations. Like, I believe in, you know, the north part of the loop. With what Google's doing, I think that La Salle street reinvention is going to be substantial. So. [00:58:06] Speaker B: Well, it's also. We're across the river from that right now. We're one block away from that right now. And, like, there's just. I. I don't know if there's still as much rhetoric around, like, the Loop being dead, but I walk down there for lunch a couple times a week and. Or go down to the Riverwalk or something to make some phone calls. That is a fallacy. If it's still being discussed. I understand some buildings have become kind of obsolete, and they probably already were. And then it just took something to kind of call that, you know, the analogy about seeing who's swimming naked when the time goes out or whatever, you know, like. But there's clearly a buzz again downtown. [00:58:47] Speaker A: Right. The city feels great, and we still need young people to go into the office. And, you know, that, that, you know, as long as it happens, you can continue to be patient. And it's already happening. [00:58:58] Speaker B: If anybody that's listening to this hasn't listened to the one with Matt Pistorio from Madison Rose, too. He does a lot of office leasing, and I've gotten. I followed his stuff a little bit more after talking with them. And it's just. It seems like they're so active and there's like, just for good product. And I think that's a little bit about how it is in the apartment space, too. You know, if we've got good building, good location, not only is it right. Really, really strong from a growth standpoint, but there's a huge flight to quality for both the customer, the resident and the investor. Just. That's the type of market we're in. [00:59:39] Speaker A: Right. [00:59:40] Speaker B: I'm going to ask you the last two questions, and then we're going to go meet a couple buddies for lunch. But I'm asking all the guests these two questions. So what's a piece of advice you'd give someone starting in their real estate career to either get going or to propel their business to the next level? We talked about a little bit earlier. [01:00:03] Speaker A: But, I mean, Tony Carmen was a broker at Transwestern, and, you know, from day one, it was just about, you know, how hard you work. It doesn't matter, you know, doesn't matter who you know. It's about how hard you work. And, you know, that. That helped, you know, do the work and make 25 calls a day and. And get the meetings and be there, you know, on a. You know, a summer day whenever you. When it's easy to go be a Wrigley, it is, too. [01:00:33] Speaker B: Yeah. It's the hard work. And then if you can. If you can couple it with consistency, you know, there's a lot of. There's a lot of stuff that people do better than me in this business, but I think very few are probably as consistent over a long period of time. I think those two things in concert with each other are pretty powerful. [01:00:53] Speaker A: Just great advice. Just put your head down, and eventually you'll keep going. You'll get through it. [01:00:59] Speaker B: Last one, dude. Why do you love Chicago as a place to live? Raise your kids, grow your business, invest. [01:01:08] Speaker A: Wherever. I travel in the world, and I love to travel. It's just. Just always feels good to come home to Chicago, you know, and that's just not changing, like, fundamentally. It. It's always going to kick ass. [01:01:18] Speaker B: Yeah. You appreciate it kind of more when you set that perspective, too. You're like, this was really fun, but it feels really good to be home. Or, I miss these restaurants. I miss the food in general. You know, I miss the people. I remember one time we went to San Diego and we're like, we went to a restaurant. It was like. It was a fun vacation in general. My wife and I went. And I'm like, why is everybody here? Like, just move so slow. Everybody was, like, halfway stoned, and it was just like, you know, like, the service is really slow. And one thing, I came home, like, this is just a stupid example, but I'm like, I went to a restaurant, and I had exceptional service at a restaurant. God, I just love Chicago. I mean, it just. Yeah, sometimes it takes going somewhere and you. It might be something stupid that you forgot to appreciate. One thing we were talking about with my buddies in Iowa is like, we're. We're going on a trip and they're talking about. They're like connecting flights. I'm like, connecting flight. I haven't taken a connecting flight. Fifteen years, like Chicago, you can get anywhere. There's a million things like that. So appreciate you taking the time to do this, man. It was fun. Anybody that wants to hear more about the neighborhood hotels, reach out to Jonathan, reach out to Matt, Stay in them. They're cool. Have your company retreats in them. They're cool. So keep at it, man. [01:02:35] Speaker A: Thanks for having me. [01:02:36] Speaker B: Cool. [01:02:36] Speaker A: Appreciate it.